SpreadcoinTalk
Spreadcoin => Main Development => Topic started by: georgem on January 08, 2016, 12:00:00 am
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So finally here it is, the update about the current state of work regarding servicenodes and spreadcoin.
I'm happy to report that development is going very well, much better than before,
also because finally there is a very clear vision about the direction we will take with servicenodes.
Contrary to previous estimations that saw "blank servicenodes" (whatever that meant) arrive on testnet at the end of 2015,
the insights I gathered during nov/dec 2015 led me to the invention of an actually useful first service which will allow us
to build a network of servicenodes that will be valuable way beyond just the spreadcoin community.
So, instead of you further waiting for "Something something servicenodes" to arrive soon, you will now know exactly what to expect as the first basic service, namely a...
Decentralized Blockexplorer
I'll let a few Screenshots of the current wallet speak:
(http://i.imgur.com/tfbBqAT.jpg)
(the ugly welcoming screen of the old wallet has disappeared, and people are directly seeing the input field of the decentralized blockexplorer, ready for immediate use)
(http://i.imgur.com/mIWRKsS.jpg)
(As an example I show one of the top Bitcoin addresses. It works exactly as you would expect from the many hundreds of centralized blockexplorers out there)
(http://i.imgur.com/vVlGfNO.jpg)
(And one of the top Dash Addresses.)
So what does this mean?
The first fully functioning service that will be enabled through servicenodes is a distributed decentralized blockexplorer, accessible thrugh the spreadcoin wallet (and spreadcoin daemon / RPC)
People who run a servicenode can host any other coin they like on the same server and register it with the servicenode.
Any such coin will then be searchable through the decentralized blockexplorer. (If a coin isn't atleast hosted by a certain amount of servicenodes (to be determined) the coin isn't considered.)
All hosted coins need to be full node daemons, but they can run without tx-indexing and disable their wallet-functionality.
The only requirement is that those daemons create and maintain a full blockchain by themselves, on the same server.
Since anyone is allowed to host any coin they like (power to the people!), we are going to see a spread of different setups of course.
See for example this servicenode overview screen that lists all the current servicenodes that I run in my small homework right now:
(http://i.imgur.com/Uoe817W.jpg)
(People can add completely new coins, or drop old ones, it's completely their own decision)
So how does it work?
Within every servicenode runs a tool called Universal Blockchain Analyzer (UBA).
It is capable of identifying and dissecting any blockchain (as long as it doesn't divert too much from current standards, but this can be further improved),
and creates its own optimized datastructure from all the data it gathers, for every coin that is registered with the servicenode (happens through the .conf file)
While this process happens, the UBA communicates and compares key data elements with other servicenodes in the network.
That's the job of the UBA: to convert relevant blockchain data for fast and easy distributed access thru the servicenode network.
The coin daemons themselves run without any disturbance. In fact the admin needs to start / stop them himself, the servicenodes won't interfere in any way with that procedure.
It is merely required that the servicenode daemon has read access to the blockchain folder of each coin, and nothing else!
Now a few more details about the servicenodes themselves.
Servicenodes that host full nodes and distribute derived blockchain data to the network to be used in the decentralized blockexplorer will earn a certain percentage of the mining reward (to be determined).
As has been planned for a long time, servicenodes won't require a fix collateral, instead the collateral will be determined by the free market.
An artificial competitive situation is created by only allowing a certain maximum amount of servicenodes to exist.
This limit isn't fixed either, it grows slowly over time.
As an example, in my home network I implemented a limit that is calculated with this formula: (total coinsupply) / 2000:
(http://i.imgur.com/BDS9oaX.jpg)
This means that with every 2000 coins that are mined there is one servicenode allowed.
(But 2000 is just an example, and will have to be determined in testnet. A few months ago we used 2880 to make a few interesting calculations.)
As you can see in the screenshots I currently run 9 Servicenodes on 9 computers.
Current total coinsupply in my very new fork is 19119, which divided by 2000 allows for 9 servicenodes to exist (or fewer, but not more).
As you can see each of these Servicenodes has its own idea about the collateral it wants to use, and this diversification creates yet another spread!
All Servicenodes are sorted according to the collateral they are willing to invest, from smallest to biggest. (the more the better)
In my example, the weakest Servicenode uses just over 100 SPR, and the strongest about 3000 SPR.
As seen in the last screenshot (Spread Distribution Screen) the distribution will probably most of the time look similar to a ski-jump.
Now why is the Servicenode with the smallest collateral called "weakest link"?
(http://i.imgur.com/mUxA0nF.png)
("weakest link")
Well, because an available seat isn't assigned to the same servicenode forever.
All seats are constantly on sale even the ones that are currently occupied ( ;D )
This means that when a newcomer arrives and he finds no empty seat, he might decide to grab one of the seats away from someone else's arse.
(but he can also come a little later when a new additional seat was created, but so will others... )
Let's imagine a few scenarios, using my example.
The 9 Servicenodes in my home network use these collaterals:
100.001
107.001
120
190.3122
335
425.1
502
1010
3000.191998
Now, imagine a newcomer arrives and wants a seat.
He could be a cheap shot and just invest 100.002, but this would be enough to "kick" the servicenode currently sitting at the weakest seat out of the race.
(BTW, "kicking" in this context merely means that the servicenode doesn't receive any rewards anymore. It does not shut down the server or any full node, or anything like that.
But what happens is that the UBA stops working, since it doesn't recognize its servicenode as valid anymore.)
What then happens, is that the newcomer becomes the new weakest link with his 100.002 collateral.
But say he would want to invest 2000 as collateral.
Now the same weakest link loses the seat, but the next 7 seats all slip down one seat, since they all must make room at the second highest seat, because that's where the 2000er is going to sit.
In this situation the servicenode that was sitting at the second lowest seat now suddenly finds itself in the weakest link position and runs the risk of losing its status next time someone appears.
And that's basically how this game will be played: a continuous switching of seats, particularly in the lower area.
If you hate this situation already, I suggest you invest lots of SPR as collateral.
Because there is a way how you can basically completely secure a seat for the foreseeable future.
(http://i.imgur.com/iFhaSYY.png)
This symbol indicates a servicenode that has such a high collateral, that it would require more than the current total coinsupply to kick this node 9 seats down!
Since this servicenode has a collateral of 3000 and it would require 9 newcomers to each invest MORE than these 3000, this would add up to an amount larger than all money that currently exists.
And therefor this seat can be considered truly secure.
BUT!
... since the total coinsupply continues to grow everyday (but slower and slower) even a now truly secured servicenode can easily be dropped down a few seats, the more free money is around and gets locked in servicenodes.
It is important to understand that "holding a high seat" has no benefits whatsoever, other than keeping you away as far as possible from the weakest link (the only "point of departure").
So the best place to actually be in is somewhere in the middle, as indicated by this symbol:
(http://i.imgur.com/I6g2RFJ.png)
This symbolises the seat that represents the arithmetic mean of the sum of all money locked in servicenodes divided by amount of servicenodes.
It can be argued that this seat (and seats close to it) are very secure, and a user that keeps adding to his collateral so that he keeps being near this mean will basically never lose his reward.
....
Alright, I could go on forever, but it's getting late.
Last thing I wanted to mention for today is the actual "servicenode manage screen":
(http://i.imgur.com/8dLYzDk.jpg)
It's where you will create new servicenodes and control the ones you already run.
(ofcourse everything will also be possible through commandline)
My goal will be to make the handling of servicenodes very easy and straight forward.
I do have a few fancy ideas about this that I want to further explore.
There is much more to mention and discuss but that's for another day.
(particularly how we tie an actual logo and name to a hosted coin is interesting)
The future looks very clear now for spreadcoin.
What I just presented is what the first testnet version will look like.
By implementing this first service we are going to build the perfect playground for the further development of the servicenode network (which will see the likes of "Proof of Bitcoin Node", a decentralized searchengine and exchange, and possibly Big Data Services in some form or another. There is lots to explore and only one rule: it needs to follow the principles of "true decentralization").
And last but not least:
I expect that I need another 50 hours or so to finish everything and put all the loose ends together before we can start testing it.
This could mean best case, that I will be ready in 1 week, or worst case by the end of january.
I will keep you updated about the progress in much more detail from now on!
Stay tuned!
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Please post all BCT updates here, this is the real SPR home 8)
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Please post all BCT updates here, this is the real SPR home 8)
You are right, I concentrate too much on the BCT thread. This has to change.
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Simply amazing achievement. Congrats
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End of year is running out. Looking forward to our surprise georgem 8)
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Ah, he must have been talking about this January. Hehe just kidding.
Hope we do see a surprise this year though. :)
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Simply amazing achievement. Congrats
Yep this is just what I needed!
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Hello, I am still new here, but interested. I have bought some SPR a few months ago for the snapshot, and I am thinking if it worth to keep all the SPR I have.
What is the next step for this coin?
When is the masternode finally implemented and come out from the test phase?
Do we know a bit more about when the servicenodes will be ready to deployment?
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masternodes in this form are not going to happen, we had a split in the community, different opinions about what way we should move. That's the reason we had this split where those who want plain masternodes can migrate to HLM.
Spreadcoin is about decentralization, and DASH-like masternodes are the opposite of that, since they are only here to serve those with the most money with a guaranteed ROI.
I need to clean up all those past threads that are mixed with false information and past plans.
Expect a big overhaul of everything.
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Just purchased spreadcoin, saw it was low assumed from people selling because of the fork maybe or something. volume and numbers seemed to be decent before the fork. I noticed however unless I'm mistaken there has not been much public updates or activity with this project. I keep searching but most of what I'm finding is all the way back in 2016. What does spreading have in its future? Do you predict prices to rise to where they were before the fork? Just looking to get some more insight into whether or not this is going to be a long-term hold or not.
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Among many things there is the spreadwallet I am working on.
If you haven't already, watch a few of the videos on my vimeo account:
https://vimeo.com/hamsterinthemachine
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Can you please PM me the key to the horney hamster service node? I didnt sell my spread after helium because I know there is a lot more to the future of spread than just a helium fork... Keep it up this looks awesome! Now that the farms are off your hashrate I'll be jumping back on :) Adding another 1080ti Nov 1 :) thank you
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Hi Georgem,
we guys are wondering if there some news about the future of SPR or maybe a specific updated roadmap. I saw your post on BTCTLK about fresh news but any specific info or at least a date for a public announcement...
The site and all the old thread had to be cleaned to clear the dubts about the masternode/servicenode (that you said was only a project of an old part of the team, and that they won't be implemented for SPR). Also if i can ask who are the devs still working on the project? Thanks for your time
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Indeed, the first thing I'm doing is cleaning up old stuff and updating everything.
Will take some time though.
So stay tuned.
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George bro can we get a time frame? You have all these people investing in your great idea and we have yet to see any incline in your research and development.
If you are in need of assistance, let me know and I can help to fund and code, as I have a fair amount of SPR and want to see this coin flourish.
Message me direct if you are interested.
If you're not interested, message me direct when its complete. I'll fly you out to AZ so we can rail some babes and hit the casinos with our fat stacks thereby produced from SpreadCoin.
Yours Truly,
CuffNasty69
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George bro can we get a time frame? You have all these people investing in your great idea and we have yet to see any incline in your research and development.
If you are in need of assistance, let me know and I can help to fund and code, as I have a fair amount of SPR and want to see this coin flourish.
Message me direct if you are interested.
If you're not interested, message me direct when its complete. I'll fly you out to AZ so we can rail some babes and hit the casinos with our fat stacks thereby produced from SpreadCoin.
Yours Truly,
CuffNasty69
He's already got "fat stack." Haven't you seen his horney hamster account. Like 1500 btc :o
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IM A NOOB!!! :) And when is the snapshot date for HELIUM?! Super excited!!! :)
Yay for free Spread! :)
SQTDgBtjnZwwmgSs2vXjtLHd9AqeGJ6o6K
Dude, I'm sorry that you fell for HELIUM, if you invested in them you must feel pretty stupid by now. I get it, but don't take this out on me.
Spreadcoin has nothing to do with HLM, for good reasons.
If you have beef with HLM, visit their thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1809278.0
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Thank you for proving the neigh-sayers wrong!!! Keep it up! Im a holder, miner and believer :) Love that there is no pool although some farms are onto the tail ends here!!!! :/
So finally here it is, the update about the current state of work regarding servicenodes and spreadcoin.
I'm happy to report that development is going very well, much better than before,
also because finally there is a very clear vision about the direction we will take with servicenodes.
Contrary to previous estimations that saw "blank servicenodes" (whatever that meant) arrive on testnet at the end of 2015,
the insights I gathered during nov/dec 2015 led me to the invention of an actually useful first service which will allow us
to build a network of servicenodes that will be valuable way beyond just the spreadcoin community.
So, instead of you further waiting for "Something something servicenodes" to arrive soon, you will now know exactly what to expect as the first basic service, namely a...
Decentralized Blockexplorer
I'll let a few Screenshots of the current wallet speak:
(http://i.imgur.com/tfbBqAT.jpg)
(the ugly welcoming screen of the old wallet has disappeared, and people are directly seeing the input field of the decentralized blockexplorer, ready for immediate use)
(http://i.imgur.com/mIWRKsS.jpg)
(As an example I show one of the top Bitcoin addresses. It works exactly as you would expect from the many hundreds of centralized blockexplorers out there)
(http://i.imgur.com/vVlGfNO.jpg)
(And one of the top Dash Addresses.)
So what does this mean?
The first fully functioning service that will be enabled through servicenodes is a distributed decentralized blockexplorer, accessible thrugh the spreadcoin wallet (and spreadcoin daemon / RPC)
People who run a servicenode can host any other coin they like on the same server and register it with the servicenode.
Any such coin will then be searchable through the decentralized blockexplorer. (If a coin isn't atleast hosted by a certain amount of servicenodes (to be determined) the coin isn't considered.)
All hosted coins need to be full node daemons, but they can run without tx-indexing and disable their wallet-functionality.
The only requirement is that those daemons create and maintain a full blockchain by themselves, on the same server.
Since anyone is allowed to host any coin they like (power to the people!), we are going to see a spread of different setups of course.
See for example this servicenode overview screen that lists all the current servicenodes that I run in my small homework right now:
(http://i.imgur.com/Uoe817W.jpg)
(People can add completely new coins, or drop old ones, it's completely their own decision)
So how does it work?
Within every servicenode runs a tool called Universal Blockchain Analyzer (UBA).
It is capable of identifying and dissecting any blockchain (as long as it doesn't divert too much from current standards, but this can be further improved),
and creates its own optimized datastructure from all the data it gathers, for every coin that is registered with the servicenode (happens through the .conf file)
While this process happens, the UBA communicates and compares key data elements with other servicenodes in the network.
That's the job of the UBA: to convert relevant blockchain data for fast and easy distributed access thru the servicenode network.
The coin daemons themselves run without any disturbance. In fact the admin needs to start / stop them himself, the servicenodes won't interfere in any way with that procedure.
It is merely required that the servicenode daemon has read access to the blockchain folder of each coin, and nothing else!
Now a few more details about the servicenodes themselves.
Servicenodes that host full nodes and distribute derived blockchain data to the network to be used in the decentralized blockexplorer will earn a certain percentage of the mining reward (to be determined).
As has been planned for a long time, servicenodes won't require a fix collateral, instead the collateral will be determined by the free market.
An artificial competitive situation is created by only allowing a certain maximum amount of servicenodes to exist.
This limit isn't fixed either, it grows slowly over time.
As an example, in my home network I implemented a limit that is calculated with this formula: (total coinsupply) / 2000:
(http://i.imgur.com/BDS9oaX.jpg)
This means that with every 2000 coins that are mined there is one servicenode allowed.
(But 2000 is just an example, and will have to be determined in testnet. A few months ago we used 2880 to make a few interesting calculations.)
As you can see in the screenshots I currently run 9 Servicenodes on 9 computers.
Current total coinsupply in my very new fork is 19119, which divided by 2000 allows for 9 servicenodes to exist (or fewer, but not more).
As you can see each of these Servicenodes has its own idea about the collateral it wants to use, and this diversification creates yet another spread!
All Servicenodes are sorted according to the collateral they are willing to invest, from smallest to biggest. (the more the better)
In my example, the weakest Servicenode uses just over 100 SPR, and the strongest about 3000 SPR.
As seen in the last screenshot (Spread Distribution Screen) the distribution will probably most of the time look similar to a ski-jump.
Now why is the Servicenode with the smallest collateral called "weakest link"?
(http://i.imgur.com/mUxA0nF.png)
("weakest link")
Well, because an available seat isn't assigned to the same servicenode forever.
All seats are constantly on sale even the ones that are currently occupied ( ;D )
This means that when a newcomer arrives and he finds no empty seat, he might decide to grab one of the seats away from someone else's arse.
(but he can also come a little later when a new additional seat was created, but so will others... )
Let's imagine a few scenarios, using my example.
The 9 Servicenodes in my home network use these collaterals:
100.001
107.001
120
190.3122
335
425.1
502
1010
3000.191998
Now, imagine a newcomer arrives and wants a seat.
He could be a cheap shot and just invest 100.002, but this would be enough to "kick" the servicenode currently sitting at the weakest seat out of the race.
(BTW, "kicking" in this context merely means that the servicenode doesn't receive any rewards anymore. It does not shut down the server or any full node, or anything like that.
But what happens is that the UBA stops working, since it doesn't recognize its servicenode as valid anymore.)
What then happens, is that the newcomer becomes the new weakest link with his 100.002 collateral.
But say he would want to invest 2000 as collateral.
Now the same weakest link loses the seat, but the next 7 seats all slip down one seat, since they all must make room at the second highest seat, because that's where the 2000er is going to sit.
In this situation the servicenode that was sitting at the second lowest seat now suddenly finds itself in the weakest link position and runs the risk of losing its status next time someone appears.
And that's basically how this game will be played: a continuous switching of seats, particularly in the lower area.
If you hate this situation already, I suggest you invest lots of SPR as collateral.
Because there is a way how you can basically completely secure a seat for the foreseeable future.
(http://i.imgur.com/iFhaSYY.png)
This symbol indicates a servicenode that has such a high collateral, that it would require more than the current total coinsupply to kick this node 9 seats down!
Since this servicenode has a collateral of 3000 and it would require 9 newcomers to each invest MORE than these 3000, this would add up to an amount larger than all money that currently exists.
And therefor this seat can be considered truly secure.
BUT!
... since the total coinsupply continues to grow everyday (but slower and slower) even a now truly secured servicenode can easily be dropped down a few seats, the more free money is around and gets locked in servicenodes.
It is important to understand that "holding a high seat" has no benefits whatsoever, other than keeping you away as far as possible from the weakest link (the only "point of departure").
So the best place to actually be in is somewhere in the middle, as indicated by this symbol:
(http://i.imgur.com/I6g2RFJ.png)
This symbolises the seat that represents the arithmetic mean of the sum of all money locked in servicenodes divided by amount of servicenodes.
It can be argued that this seat (and seats close to it) are very secure, and a user that keeps adding to his collateral so that he keeps being near this mean will basically never lose his reward.
....
Alright, I could go on forever, but it's getting late.
Last thing I wanted to mention for today is the actual "servicenode manage screen":
(http://i.imgur.com/8dLYzDk.jpg)
It's where you will create new servicenodes and control the ones you already run.
(ofcourse everything will also be possible through commandline)
My goal will be to make the handling of servicenodes very easy and straight forward.
I do have a few fancy ideas about this that I want to further explore.
There is much more to mention and discuss but that's for another day.
(particularly how we tie an actual logo and name to a hosted coin is interesting)
The future looks very clear now for spreadcoin.
What I just presented is what the first testnet version will look like.
By implementing this first service we are going to build the perfect playground for the further development of the servicenode network (which will see the likes of "Proof of Bitcoin Node", a decentralized searchengine and exchange, and possibly Big Data Services in some form or another. There is lots to explore and only one rule: it needs to follow the principles of "true decentralization").
And last but not least:
I expect that I need another 50 hours or so to finish everything and put all the loose ends together before we can start testing it.
This could mean best case, that I will be ready in 1 week, or worst case by the end of january.
I will keep you updated about the progress in much more detail from now on!
Stay tuned!
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hi Georgem is there any news ,dates maybe
very excited about the new features but want to know in which stage the development is now
i have a lot of SPR and hope it sha"l rise again
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No need to be mysterious unless you're being deceptive man, tell us what's up.
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Patreons get first dips on updates and help me fund development:
https://www.patreon.com/hamsterinthemachine
I don't care how much SPR you own, so stop mentioning it.
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Hi georgem, time is running and none has notice of you or new update for the project. You haven't cleaned the site/forum yet...
Ok that the news will be released to the patreon supporters first but I honestly won't support a likely dead developer... Sorry for my direct speech but it's a while since the helium guys left.
Thanks for your time
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ATTENTION!
GEORGEM
You always Betray people believed You?
Thousands! believed in You personally! and paid their own money for Your promises and Words that "Spreadcoin is alive and well." (Last time at October 11, 2017 at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=144737;sa=showPosts
You RIP them All. You Did nothing! And You couldn't - because You're Impotent.
You're NOT a men of Honor!
You just a BASTARD LIAR!
EveryOne now see it.
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Man, you guys need to chill the fuck out. You chose to keep your investments in a fairly large project with a single developer. It's just not going to be a fast moving project. Georgem can you just confirm that SPR will continue development? Not looking for specifics on a timeline but if you are going to put it down, I'll unload. If not I'll hold on.
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Yes, as I have repeatedly said: development is continued!
Website is online, forum is online, I have a patreon account with 5 long term supporters that get a closer look at current development.
If more people want to support me to facilitate development, that would be a great help.
Thanks.
Meanwhile be patient so I can get everything in order.
The "exit scam" (too soon?) known as HLM (Helium) has left Spreadcoin with even more problems now.
As if it wasn't enough that the original SPR developer left a dead original thread and dead original github we can't access...
...we are now additionally tied to this HLM exit scam because of some unscrupulous PR-investors.
(At least that's what it starts to look like with every day that passes. But feel free to prove me wrong.)
Officially there is no problem, since I never promoted HLM on any website or forum that I control, since I realized from the start what HLM really is, but they still managed to create quite a loud mess.
We need to properly address all that through the official channels.
I'll do that in the coming updates.
Georgem
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Thanks to Georgem
Patience with the SPR should be respected.
This time around is very long with those who are trusting the SPR but we believe in this project and believe in you
We expect good things to come soon in the new update
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Georgem
What are You talking about??
Nobody talk and care about Hellium.
We talk about You and Your NOW shitcoin Spreadcoin
You can't even explain and calm Your investors!!
You work as developer of that coin??
HAHAHAHAHA - You can't! You can only sitting, crying and shitting how bad hellium was that sent You to Hell with Your fucking mind.
You're Not a Dev we believed in - YOU ARE LOOSER.
And You will loose Bittrex very soon.
BB impotent.
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You disagree with me?? - Just check a price for Your shitcoin!!!
LOOSER!
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I think it's very good that georgem is continuing forward. Let's just focus on the future and try to keep positive.
It is definitely possible for the spreadcoin project to reboot.
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This thread has long been dead BTW, (it's back from a time when I actually considered working with the same guys that brought you HLM, what was I thinking, lol)
So I see no meaning in continuing the discussion here.
THIS is the main thread about spreadcoin, you can talk about everything there:
http://spreadcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762.0
I'm locking this thread down now.